Opinion Time! Freeplay

Anything Reus-related that doesn't fit the other forums.

Unlocks in freeplay for that game only: how do you feel?

Ruins value of unlocks
43
35%
don't care
29
24%
YES PLEASE!
50
41%
 
Total votes: 122

Caiobrz
Posts: 43
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 12:43 pm

Re: Opinion Time! Freeplay

Post by Caiobrz » Sat May 25, 2013 12:06 am

VDZ wrote:Hmm...how about an additional game mode, in addition to Era and Free Play (which would then remain unchanged): You start with every unlockable resource being locked, and to unlock the resources for that game you need to achieve the goals required to unlock it in that very same game.

As you start without any unlockables whatsoever, you're at a clear disadvantage compared to Era and Free Play, but at the same time it allows you to play with every unlockable resource there is. It also doubles as an additional challenge to all players: reach as many goals as you can (or try for ALL of them) in a single session without a time limit. Bonus points for competitive play if it also marks the game time it took you to reach each goal, so competitive players can try to reach level 2/level 3/all goals/a specific goal as quickly as possible and compare their times.
That's a good idea, but that's totally different from the freeplay, and in fact, is even more restrictive than the current freeplay, albeit the question of the thread was to actually open it more! So the question is: are you proposing this new game mode AND remove unlockables from freeplay, or keep the freeplay and add this new (more restrictive) ? (a.k.a you voted yes or no? =p)

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VDZ
Posts: 31
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 8:27 am

Re: Opinion Time! Freeplay

Post by VDZ » Sat May 25, 2013 12:47 am

Caiobrz wrote:That's a good idea, but that's totally different from the freeplay, and in fact, is even more restrictive than the current freeplay, albeit the question of the thread was to actually open it more! So the question is: are you proposing this new game mode AND remove unlockables from freeplay, or keep the freeplay and add this new (more restrictive) ? (a.k.a you voted yes or no? =p)
I voted 'yes'. My idea was to keep Era and Free Play exactly as they are right now, but add a third mode like I described.

PinkPhoton
Posts: 1
Joined: Mon May 20, 2013 1:31 am

Re: Opinion Time! Freeplay

Post by PinkPhoton » Sun May 26, 2013 4:41 pm

A freeplay mode where you start with everything locked but can unlock them during gameplay sounds like a lot of fun.

digus
Posts: 3
Joined: Thu May 23, 2013 5:47 am

Re: Opinion Time! Freeplay

Post by digus » Sun May 26, 2013 6:21 pm

Like other people said, I think it should be a different mode, I like the idea of freeplay like it's now.

I have only played era games because I want to unlock every think before start a freeplay. If I would have to unlock everything again on freeplay the only point of the unlocks would be for the era mode.

But what I really think is the best idea is a freeplay mode totally customizable.
Someone said on another topic something about game options for freeplay: No wars, always at war, no ambassador limit, no requisite for nomads...
So there could be a option like "every thing locked but unlock-able in this freeplay session". This could be a option available from the start, or unlocked at the end of the tutorial, and the other options unlocked in era mode.
Playing an era without war marks would unlock the no war option. Play an era where 10 villages are destroyed at war to unlock always war option, and so on...

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miruki
Posts: 6
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 10:57 pm

Re: Opinion Time! Freeplay

Post by miruki » Sun May 26, 2013 7:27 pm

digus wrote:But what I really think is the best idea is a freeplay mode totally customizable.
Someone said on another topic something about game options for freeplay: No wars, always at war, no ambassador limit, no requisite for nomads...
So there could be a option like "every thing locked but unlock-able in this freeplay session". This could be a option available from the start, or unlocked at the end of the tutorial, and the other options unlocked in era mode.
Playing an era without war marks would unlock the no war option. Play an era where 10 villages are destroyed at war to unlock always war option, and so on...
This. So much.

I think the option to have all sources should be available after completing one era game, but unlocking the additional options sounds like a fun motivation to go through the era modes a couple of times again, ... at least to me it would be much more motivating than starting a 60 or 120 minute game just to unlock 1 or 2 of the sources I'm still missing. (My brain is not really capable of actively handling more than 2 unlocks at the same time, any additional unlocks in an era game have been pure luck... ;>)

Dak0m
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu May 23, 2013 5:44 pm

Re: Opinion Time! Freeplay

Post by Dak0m » Sun May 26, 2013 9:58 pm

I'm not a completionist, so I think the more freedom we have to experiment and play around in Freeplay, right from the start, the better. Also, thanks so much for making this poll. I really look forward to whatever related fun stuff you guys/girls have in the works ^_^

** A "totally customizable freeplay" mode, as digus said, would be neat :P **

Szei
Posts: 11
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 4:42 am

Re: Opinion Time! Freeplay

Post by Szei » Mon May 27, 2013 2:23 am

digus wrote: But what I really think is the best idea is a freeplay mode totally customizable.
Someone said on another topic something about game options for freeplay: No wars, always at war, no ambassador limit, no requisite for nomads...
So there could be a option like "every thing locked but unlock-able in this freeplay session". This could be a option available from the start, or unlocked at the end of the tutorial, and the other options unlocked in era mode.
Playing an era without war marks would unlock the no war option. Play an era where 10 villages are destroyed at war to unlock always war option, and so on...
I agree completely.

As for people who voted that unlocking everything in freeplay (for that game only) would devalue unlocks, I don't see why. You can't get score in freeplay nor can you unlock anything via freeplay to use in era mode. The integrity of era mode and its "score attack" theme remain intact.

Darexon
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun May 26, 2013 12:59 pm

Re: Opinion Time! Freeplay

Post by Darexon » Tue May 28, 2013 6:33 am

I voted yes because it makes the game more interesting for those playing in freeplay who don't have all of the unlocks and allows you to try out some of the unlocks.

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Adriaan
Posts: 739
Joined: Wed Nov 28, 2012 5:18 pm

Re: Opinion Time! Freeplay

Post by Adriaan » Tue May 28, 2013 11:22 am

Ok update time!

This...isn't helping. :P

The votes are very divided, and I can see why. Therefor, in any case, I won't make unlocks so easily obtainable. I don't want to anger one half just to please the other. :P I'm looking for other ways to appeal to everyone.
Don't worry about game modes, they're on my fantastic three list of things that really should be available in the game at some point.

For those who a interested in the dilemma, here is what is playing:

Reus is a bit brutal and roguelike when it comes to progression. It's not unfair, but it's not forgiving either. Also, complexity rises as you become better in the game. This makes the game ideal and super fun for explorer-achievers. It's hard to get to a point, but you're always rewarded with a new option to explore. Aside of Natural Sources are everything we can reward (it's not), this gives a feeling of entitlement, achievement and excitement. I don't know if you ever talked about Reus with a friend, but you're probably bragging about how you got Ginkgo or Panda, while he might be telling how awesome Coal is. It's a great way to soothe the learning curve, add challenge with high exploration value, and give a true feeling of achievement. (kind of like advanced wars did with unlocking different commanders.) It's certainly how I play the game, and I know a lot of other do it as well.
basically: value = effort * reward
and: effort = time * skill

On the side of that, timed games get the best out of Reus' mechanics when it comes to challenge and exploration. The game is more interesting at the end of a 60 minutes game, when you still haven't got everything, some projects are still running, and you think:"damn, I'm pretty sure I could do even better". I find that freeplay and 120 minutes game are more capped by space, end build and possibilities, while 60 minutes game are bottle-necked by you making the right decision with the right execution. Still, they both have their charm. Freeplay is probably now used to make a perfect planet, 120 minutes is used for the challenge with the biggest numbers and highest levels.

However, there are a lot of players who either don't like timed challenges, or challenges at all. They want a challenge purely based on what they build, or just want to build in a god mode. For those people, having the unlocks within reach is important. And within reach, it means probably lower time or lower skill. Which results in lower effort, which results in lower value. This is in direct contradiction to something a lot of people love in Reus.

So now I'm looking for other options. I could indeed create a whole new challenge mode, based on prosperity instead of based on time. However, I know the game is less fun without the time pressure (It's the last added feature so we did a long time without it, and time pressure syngergizes with the greed mechanic so well), and I would imagine seeing myself playing 1 or 2 long untimed games to unlock everything, and then say: "ok unlocked everything" and be done within 5 to 12 hours, against the 30-40 hours a normal player would take to unlock everything now with more difficult dilemmas and excitement. If I would have bought Reus, I would get a lot less value for the game with the extra mode then I would have now. That makes this still a hard decision (also, 67 new achievements. Not looking forward spending time on doing that).

I genuinely think era mode is the best suited for Reus when it comes to challenge and exploration, and people frustrated with it are the people who cannot or do not want to put the effort in it. That might be lack of time, lack of skill, or maybe time is not well spent enough (for example, the early game gets to tedious), or a too high learning curve. That's perfectly fine, and has nothing to do with these people being noobs or lazy, it just means the game currently doesn't suit their needs. Could be just the best and most industrious League of Legends player in the world looking for a relaxing quick building game in between the tense games of League of Legends.

I'm thinking about letting this issue rest for a bit, and to look at different options. Some things I'm considering: cheats, better early game, more game modes with different challenges for a change of pace. I think these solutions have a higher chance to please more people without disappointing the ones who are already big fans of the game.

Thanks all for the good suggestions and elaborated feedback!

coanda
Posts: 54
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:46 am

Re: Opinion Time! Freeplay

Post by coanda » Tue May 28, 2013 11:30 am

I know you have a lot on your plate, but one thing I would find interesting is a randomized mode where you get, say, most of the level-1, half the level-2, and a handful of level-3 sources unlocked... chosen at random. Then you can see how good a world you can put together with the limited selection you do have available.

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